[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]
[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]

[/QUOTE]

Amazing- more statistical garbage. First off Obama signed into law the largest tax CUT in history.
A crappy article written by right wing hacks!

I am amazed at Red Neck Bill here, These "charts" all prove what an awful job the previous president did- as Obama did not take office till 2009- evey chart is pre '09. I support my president- and again Bill you are full of sh1t!! Talk to me aboot Canada eh!
[/QUOTE]

[COLOR=#2F3699]Crayy article? Hmm, The truth hurts. All the man did was point out some basic facts and you go nuts?

Typical of any liberal left wing nut. You are not cabale of linear thinking and when confronted with truth you do not like you get all angry and bothered

If you have cared to read or been able to understand, you would know that the charts and article deals with the past 60 (get that ignoramous? SIXTY years of history) and it does not blame Bush or Obama for the problem. It does make it clear that when you are bankrupt as a gov. it is plain STUPID (as any 10 year old knows) to run huge deficits and give tax cuts. You blinded suckers are happy with Obama, thank God I am in the DR and will not have to pay back the 1.5 MILLION in debt per family of four that you will have to. You will be happy when he next pres. in 4 years when Obama is kicked out for being the greatest failure in 200 years, will have to DOUBLE ALL YOUR TAXESand yu pay for his stupidity.

Did you know that right now, if Obama took every dollar earned by every American, he would not be ableto pay for his deficit spending? So who will? He has a bigger deficit than all presidens on 200 years, and one that is 3-4 times larger than Bush's. What a total idiot commie!

As for CAnada, being a much smarter lot, our bansk stayed out of the whole debt swap thing the other countries banks got into. Back in the 90's we passed legsialtion preventing our banks from getting into the USA made mess. So our bansk are strong and sound. House across Canada actually went up in value in the past two years when USA houses dropped by as much as 50%. Our banks did not make stupid loans on inflated values on houses so we avoided the housing bubble. I still have development property in Canada and I thnak God it is not in the USA!

Sure I love to point out how diff. we are as Canadians![/COLOR]
[/QUOTE]
[B]
[COLOR=#ED1C24]Red Neck... I have an MBA and can spot garbage like this a mile away. Stats can be manipulated for any argument douche. The last eight years broke this country- in general increases in spending while incomes dropped for most Americans, coupled with the AIG debacle (this was where no governmental oversight comes into play) have created this world wide crises. All the while the Bush's and Cheneys of the world made a killing. Brown and Root et al.

Banks we're giving away mortgages, people in credit card debt got more cards in the mail- and the debt ball grew- banks sold said debt times over- where the hell was the SEC? And what about Enron?? Obama is working to fix it and I hope he does, as the right has done NOTHING to solve this crisis. They seem to be more interested in having the President and Government fail than offering solutions. There needs to be oversight and these institutions need to be regulated for their own good. Not one solid republican rebuttal has been offered up!! And as you are Canadian living in the DR I will certainly not come to you for advice. So stop hating on Obama and keep an eye on the Sanky's at your place douchebag.

Want me to break it down? The only way to get out of the hole we are in is to rebuild. Our economy is stagnant- even W recognized that in order to stimulate the economy, the government would have to put some money in people's pockets. (Stimulus checks) But it was too little too late. If you can step out of your incredible charts and hack garbage, you may be able to think linearly and see what has to be done. In order to jump start the economy, we need to put more money in people's pockets- i.e. tax cuts, job development (infrastructure), and regulation. When you build a house to you start with the roof? NO bottom up... Scale back Bushie's lack of taxes on the top 1%- tax them, relieve the tax burden on the middle class thus promoting the establishment of this country's economic marrow- the small business.

BTW- I absolutely love Canadians, great drinkers, great people- I have lifelong friends fraternity brothers at McGill. I envy their education system to be honest. But, you Billy, need to come work and live in the US as part of the middle class to see what really has been going on- until then cut the crap. [/COLOR][B][/B][/B]
[/QUOTE]

I agree the middle class in the USA is screwed, and the rich way over taxed. As for MBA's, they are not worth much these days and many people prefer to hire people without one....I do have a couple of friends in the USA - mostly business owners but also somne regular joes.

As for stats, sure, but those charts cannot be maniuplated - they are factual - you can twist the deductions but not the most baisc fact:

The USA began the buy now pay later scheme when I was a kid int he 60's! I saw the first signs in the windows. That borrow and spend is what has killed a once mighty nation, along with the $70 an hour for a guy to put 4 bolts on a car. And the economy cannot rebound until the debt is reigned in.

One of the charts has a interesting sign -while savings dropped for 10 years in the uSA, in the last year they started to go up.

Did it ever occur to you that someone might object if you had a 500 foot floating gin palace while everone else had leaky canoes? Are they just stupid jelous people? Or even should they care if you were eating one of the last big Tuna's in the world? I am a social democrat not a communist - although I guess Europe is glad that Stalin was around when he was.
Now there is an ideal window of opportunity to put a bid in!
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24593669-5018061,00.html
( only 272 ft )

S.

[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]
[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]

[/QUOTE]

Amazing- more statistical garbage. First off Obama signed into law the largest tax CUT in history.
A crappy article written by right wing hacks!

I am amazed at Red Neck Bill here, These "charts" all prove what an awful job the previous president did- as Obama did not take office till 2009- evey chart is pre '09. I support my president- and again Bill you are full of sh1t!! Talk to me aboot Canada eh!
[/QUOTE]

[COLOR=#2F3699]Crayy article? Hmm, The truth hurts. All the man did was point out some basic facts and you go nuts?

Typical of any liberal left wing nut. You are not cabale of linear thinking and when confronted with truth you do not like you get all angry and bothered

If you have cared to read or been able to understand, you would know that the charts and article deals with the past 60 (get that ignoramous? SIXTY years of history) and it does not blame Bush or Obama for the problem. It does make it clear that when you are bankrupt as a gov. it is plain STUPID (as any 10 year old knows) to run huge deficits and give tax cuts. You blinded suckers are happy with Obama, thank God I am in the DR and will not have to pay back the 1.5 MILLION in debt per family of four that you will have to. You will be happy when he next pres. in 4 years when Obama is kicked out for being the greatest failure in 200 years, will have to DOUBLE ALL YOUR TAXESand yu pay for his stupidity.

Did you know that right now, if Obama took every dollar earned by every American, he would not be ableto pay for his deficit spending? So who will? He has a bigger deficit than all presidens on 200 years, and one that is 3-4 times larger than Bush's. What a total idiot commie!

As for CAnada, being a much smarter lot, our bansk stayed out of the whole debt swap thing the other countries banks got into. Back in the 90's we passed legsialtion preventing our banks from getting into the USA made mess. So our bansk are strong and sound. House across Canada actually went up in value in the past two years when USA houses dropped by as much as 50%. Our banks did not make stupid loans on inflated values on houses so we avoided the housing bubble. I still have development property in Canada and I thnak God it is not in the USA!

Sure I love to point out how diff. we are as Canadians![/COLOR]
[/QUOTE]
[B]
[COLOR=#ED1C24]Red Neck... I have an MBA and can spot garbage like this a mile away. Stats can be manipulated for any argument douche. The last eight years broke this country- in general increases in spending while incomes dropped for most Americans, coupled with the AIG debacle (this was where no governmental oversight comes into play) have created this world wide crises. All the while the Bush's and Cheneys of the world made a killing. Brown and Root et al.

Banks we're giving away mortgages, people in credit card debt got more cards in the mail- and the debt ball grew- banks sold said debt times over- where the hell was the SEC? And what about Enron?? Obama is working to fix it and I hope he does, as the right has done NOTHING to solve this crisis. They seem to be more interested in having the President and Government fail than offering solutions. There needs to be oversight and these institutions need to be regulated for their own good. Not one solid republican rebuttal has been offered up!! And as you are Canadian living in the DR I will certainly not come to you for advice. So stop hating on Obama and keep an eye on the Sanky's at your place douchebag.

Want me to break it down? The only way to get out of the hole we are in is to rebuild. Our economy is stagnant- even W recognized that in order to stimulate the economy, the government would have to put some money in people's pockets. (Stimulus checks) But it was too little too late. If you can step out of your incredible charts and hack garbage, you may be able to think linearly and see what has to be done. In order to jump start the economy, we need to put more money in people's pockets- i.e. tax cuts, job development (infrastructure), and regulation. When you build a house to you start with the roof? NO bottom up... Scale back Bushie's lack of taxes on the top 1%- tax them, relieve the tax burden on the middle class thus promoting the establishment of this country's economic marrow- the small business.

BTW- I absolutely love Canadians, great drinkers, great people- I have lifelong friends fraternity brothers at McGill. I envy their education system to be honest. But, you Billy, need to come work and live in the US as part of the middle class to see what really has been going on- until then cut the crap. [/COLOR][B][/B][/B]
[/QUOTE]

I agree the middle class in the USA is screwed, and the rich way over taxed. As for MBA's, they are not worth much these days and many people prefer to hire people without one....I do have a couple of friends in the USA - mostly business owners but also somne regular joes.

As for stats, sure, but those charts cannot be maniuplated - they are factual - you can twist the deductions but not the most baisc fact:

The USA began the buy now pay later scheme when I was a kid int he 60's! I saw the first signs in the windows. That borrow and spend is what has killed a once mighty nation, along with the $70 an hour for a guy to put 4 bolts on a car. And the economy cannot rebound until the debt is reigned in.

One of the charts has a interesting sign -while savings dropped for 10 years in the uSA, in the last year they started to go up.

[/QUOTE]

MBA's? Well its a good thing I'm doing well... I disagree Bill, debt can be held even managed during a bear market, look back to your hero Reagan, who i can blame all this on. He encountered a pretty serious and dormant economy- double dip recession, double digit inflation etc... What happened? He increased government spending, a quarter more than when he took office by the time he left- tripling the countries debt. It is proven, debt won't break you- unwillingness to put money back into the economy will. Granted Obama's solutions will not solve this overnight, he is taking the proper measures, debt can be reigned in with a stronger economy ala Bill Clinton.

And I'm the ignoramus?

[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]
[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]
[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]

[/QUOTE]

Amazing- more statistical garbage. First off Obama signed into law the largest tax CUT in history.
A crappy article written by right wing hacks!

I am amazed at Red Neck Bill here, These "charts" all prove what an awful job the previous president did- as Obama did not take office till 2009- evey chart is pre '09. I support my president- and again Bill you are full of sh1t!! Talk to me aboot Canada eh!
[/QUOTE]

[COLOR=#2F3699]Crayy article? Hmm, The truth hurts. All the man did was point out some basic facts and you go nuts?

Typical of any liberal left wing nut. You are not cabale of linear thinking and when confronted with truth you do not like you get all angry and bothered

If you have cared to read or been able to understand, you would know that the charts and article deals with the past 60 (get that ignoramous? SIXTY years of history) and it does not blame Bush or Obama for the problem. It does make it clear that when you are bankrupt as a gov. it is plain STUPID (as any 10 year old knows) to run huge deficits and give tax cuts. You blinded suckers are happy with Obama, thank God I am in the DR and will not have to pay back the 1.5 MILLION in debt per family of four that you will have to. You will be happy when he next pres. in 4 years when Obama is kicked out for being the greatest failure in 200 years, will have to DOUBLE ALL YOUR TAXESand yu pay for his stupidity.

Did you know that right now, if Obama took every dollar earned by every American, he would not be ableto pay for his deficit spending? So who will? He has a bigger deficit than all presidens on 200 years, and one that is 3-4 times larger than Bush's. What a total idiot commie!

As for CAnada, being a much smarter lot, our bansk stayed out of the whole debt swap thing the other countries banks got into. Back in the 90's we passed legsialtion preventing our banks from getting into the USA made mess. So our bansk are strong and sound. House across Canada actually went up in value in the past two years when USA houses dropped by as much as 50%. Our banks did not make stupid loans on inflated values on houses so we avoided the housing bubble. I still have development property in Canada and I thnak God it is not in the USA!

Sure I love to point out how diff. we are as Canadians![/COLOR]
[/QUOTE]
[B]
[COLOR=#ED1C24]Red Neck... I have an MBA and can spot garbage like this a mile away. Stats can be manipulated for any argument douche. The last eight years broke this country- in general increases in spending while incomes dropped for most Americans, coupled with the AIG debacle (this was where no governmental oversight comes into play) have created this world wide crises. All the while the Bush's and Cheneys of the world made a killing. Brown and Root et al.

Banks we're giving away mortgages, people in credit card debt got more cards in the mail- and the debt ball grew- banks sold said debt times over- where the hell was the SEC? And what about Enron?? Obama is working to fix it and I hope he does, as the right has done NOTHING to solve this crisis. They seem to be more interested in having the President and Government fail than offering solutions. There needs to be oversight and these institutions need to be regulated for their own good. Not one solid republican rebuttal has been offered up!! And as you are Canadian living in the DR I will certainly not come to you for advice. So stop hating on Obama and keep an eye on the Sanky's at your place douchebag.

Want me to break it down? The only way to get out of the hole we are in is to rebuild. Our economy is stagnant- even W recognized that in order to stimulate the economy, the government would have to put some money in people's pockets. (Stimulus checks) But it was too little too late. If you can step out of your incredible charts and hack garbage, you may be able to think linearly and see what has to be done. In order to jump start the economy, we need to put more money in people's pockets- i.e. tax cuts, job development (infrastructure), and regulation. When you build a house to you start with the roof? NO bottom up... Scale back Bushie's lack of taxes on the top 1%- tax them, relieve the tax burden on the middle class thus promoting the establishment of this country's economic marrow- the small business.

BTW- I absolutely love Canadians, great drinkers, great people- I have lifelong friends fraternity brothers at McGill. I envy their education system to be honest. But, you Billy, need to come work and live in the US as part of the middle class to see what really has been going on- until then cut the crap. [/COLOR][B][/B][/B]
[/QUOTE]

I agree the middle class in the USA is screwed, and the rich way over taxed. As for MBA's, they are not worth much these days and many people prefer to hire people without one....I do have a couple of friends in the USA - mostly business owners but also somne regular joes.

As for stats, sure, but those charts cannot be maniuplated - they are factual - you can twist the deductions but not the most baisc fact:

The USA began the buy now pay later scheme when I was a kid int he 60's! I saw the first signs in the windows. That borrow and spend is what has killed a once mighty nation, along with the $70 an hour for a guy to put 4 bolts on a car. And the economy cannot rebound until the debt is reigned in.

One of the charts has a interesting sign -while savings dropped for 10 years in the uSA, in the last year they started to go up.

[/QUOTE]

MBA's? Well its a good thing I'm doing well... I disagree Bill, debt can be held even managed during a bear market, look back to your hero Reagan, who i can blame all this on. He encountered a pretty serious and dormant economy- double dip recession, double digit inflation etc... What happened? He increased government spending, a quarter more than when he took office by the time he left- tripling the countries debt. It is proven, debt won't break you- unwillingness to put money back into the economy will. Granted Obama's solutions will not solve this overnight, he is taking the proper measures, debt can be reigned in with a stronger economy ala Bill Clinton.
[/QUOTE]


I agree debt will not break a country if it is reasonable and an investment. Reagan saved the USA. Clinton coasted on what Reagan accomplished. BUt how much debt is reasonable? The lefty spenders (and Bush was a lefty spender) are about to find out.

The Titianic was not supposed to be sinkable, even by God (big mistake saying that) but it went down.

Obama took over the Titanic 10 min. aqfter it hit the iceburg. His idea of saving the Titanic is to steer right into a bigger DEBT icerburg on the other side

How much is your USA debt per captia. Now add the state and municiple and personal debt. Then add the unfunded LIABILITY for seniors and social security.

1.4 MILLION per family of four. As well as funding and running the country every year for the next 40 years with ever greater deficits each year, the above MUST be repaid, and it does not include personal debt. WOW - your paychecks are going to see 50% and more in taxation and it will not be enough. So print money like crazy. And end up with a northern pesos.

[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]
[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]
[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]

[/QUOTE]

Amazing- more statistical garbage. First off Obama signed into law the largest tax CUT in history.
A crappy article written by right wing hacks!

I am amazed at Red Neck Bill here, These "charts" all prove what an awful job the previous president did- as Obama did not take office till 2009- evey chart is pre '09. I support my president- and again Bill you are full of sh1t!! Talk to me aboot Canada eh!
[/QUOTE]

[COLOR=#2F3699]Crayy article? Hmm, The truth hurts. All the man did was point out some basic facts and you go nuts?

Typical of any liberal left wing nut. You are not cabale of linear thinking and when confronted with truth you do not like you get all angry and bothered

If you have cared to read or been able to understand, you would know that the charts and article deals with the past 60 (get that ignoramous? SIXTY years of history) and it does not blame Bush or Obama for the problem. It does make it clear that when you are bankrupt as a gov. it is plain STUPID (as any 10 year old knows) to run huge deficits and give tax cuts. You blinded suckers are happy with Obama, thank God I am in the DR and will not have to pay back the 1.5 MILLION in debt per family of four that you will have to. You will be happy when he next pres. in 4 years when Obama is kicked out for being the greatest failure in 200 years, will have to DOUBLE ALL YOUR TAXESand yu pay for his stupidity.

Did you know that right now, if Obama took every dollar earned by every American, he would not be ableto pay for his deficit spending? So who will? He has a bigger deficit than all presidens on 200 years, and one that is 3-4 times larger than Bush's. What a total idiot commie!

As for CAnada, being a much smarter lot, our bansk stayed out of the whole debt swap thing the other countries banks got into. Back in the 90's we passed legsialtion preventing our banks from getting into the USA made mess. So our bansk are strong and sound. House across Canada actually went up in value in the past two years when USA houses dropped by as much as 50%. Our banks did not make stupid loans on inflated values on houses so we avoided the housing bubble. I still have development property in Canada and I thnak God it is not in the USA!

Sure I love to point out how diff. we are as Canadians![/COLOR]
[/QUOTE]
[B]
[COLOR=#ED1C24]Red Neck... I have an MBA and can spot garbage like this a mile away. Stats can be manipulated for any argument douche. The last eight years broke this country- in general increases in spending while incomes dropped for most Americans, coupled with the AIG debacle (this was where no governmental oversight comes into play) have created this world wide crises. All the while the Bush's and Cheneys of the world made a killing. Brown and Root et al.

Banks we're giving away mortgages, people in credit card debt got more cards in the mail- and the debt ball grew- banks sold said debt times over- where the hell was the SEC? And what about Enron?? Obama is working to fix it and I hope he does, as the right has done NOTHING to solve this crisis. They seem to be more interested in having the President and Government fail than offering solutions. There needs to be oversight and these institutions need to be regulated for their own good. Not one solid republican rebuttal has been offered up!! And as you are Canadian living in the DR I will certainly not come to you for advice. So stop hating on Obama and keep an eye on the Sanky's at your place douchebag.

Want me to break it down? The only way to get out of the hole we are in is to rebuild. Our economy is stagnant- even W recognized that in order to stimulate the economy, the government would have to put some money in people's pockets. (Stimulus checks) But it was too little too late. If you can step out of your incredible charts and hack garbage, you may be able to think linearly and see what has to be done. In order to jump start the economy, we need to put more money in people's pockets- i.e. tax cuts, job development (infrastructure), and regulation. When you build a house to you start with the roof? NO bottom up... Scale back Bushie's lack of taxes on the top 1%- tax them, relieve the tax burden on the middle class thus promoting the establishment of this country's economic marrow- the small business.

BTW- I absolutely love Canadians, great drinkers, great people- I have lifelong friends fraternity brothers at McGill. I envy their education system to be honest. But, you Billy, need to come work and live in the US as part of the middle class to see what really has been going on- until then cut the crap. [/COLOR][B][/B][/B]
[/QUOTE]

I agree the middle class in the USA is screwed, and the rich way over taxed. As for MBA's, they are not worth much these days and many people prefer to hire people without one....I do have a couple of friends in the USA - mostly business owners but also somne regular joes.

As for stats, sure, but those charts cannot be maniuplated - they are factual - you can twist the deductions but not the most baisc fact:

The USA began the buy now pay later scheme when I was a kid int he 60's! I saw the first signs in the windows. That borrow and spend is what has killed a once mighty nation, along with the $70 an hour for a guy to put 4 bolts on a car. And the economy cannot rebound until the debt is reigned in.

One of the charts has a interesting sign -while savings dropped for 10 years in the uSA, in the last year they started to go up.

[/QUOTE]

MBA's? Well its a good thing I'm doing well... I disagree Bill, debt can be held even managed during a bear market, look back to your hero Reagan, who i can blame all this on. He encountered a pretty serious and dormant economy- double dip recession, double digit inflation etc... What happened? He increased government spending, a quarter more than when he took office by the time he left- tripling the countries debt. It is proven, debt won't break you- unwillingness to put money back into the economy will. Granted Obama's solutions will not solve this overnight, he is taking the proper measures, debt can be reigned in with a stronger economy ala Bill Clinton.
[/QUOTE]


I agree debt will not break a country if it is reasonable and an investment. Reagan saved the USA. Clinton coasted on what Reagan accomplished. BUt how much debt is reasonable? The lefty spenders (and Bush was a lefty spender) are about to find out.

The Titianic was not supposed to be sinkable, even by God (big mistake saying that) but it went down.

Obama took over the Titanic 10 min. aqfter it hit the iceburg. His idea of saving the Titanic is to steer right into a bigger DEBT icerburg on the other side

How much is your USA debt per captia. Now add the state and municiple and personal debt. Then add the unfunded LIABILITY for seniors and social security.

1.4 MILLION per family of four. As well as funding and running the country every year for the next 40 years with ever greater deficits each year, the above MUST be repaid, and it does not include personal debt. WOW - your paychecks are going to see 50% and more in taxation and it will not be enough. So print money like crazy. And end up with a northern pesos.
[/QUOTE]


You are stupid - debt never has to be repaid only rolled forward, written off or forgiven. Cos go bust and never repay. e.g. GM.
http://www.uiowa.edu/ifdebook/briefings/docs/forgiveness.shtml
S.

[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]
[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]
[QUOTE=cabaretewilliam]
[QUOTE=EnLaCapital]

[/QUOTE]

Amazing- more statistical garbage. First off Obama signed into law the largest tax CUT in history.
A crappy article written by right wing hacks!

I am amazed at Red Neck Bill here, These "charts" all prove what an awful job the previous president did- as Obama did not take office till 2009- evey chart is pre '09. I support my president- and again Bill you are full of sh1t!! Talk to me aboot Canada eh!
[/QUOTE]

[COLOR=#2F3699]Crayy article? Hmm, The truth hurts. All the man did was point out some basic facts and you go nuts?

Typical of any liberal left wing nut. You are not cabale of linear thinking and when confronted with truth you do not like you get all angry and bothered

If you have cared to read or been able to understand, you would know that the charts and article deals with the past 60 (get that ignoramous? SIXTY years of history) and it does not blame Bush or Obama for the problem. It does make it clear that when you are bankrupt as a gov. it is plain STUPID (as any 10 year old knows) to run huge deficits and give tax cuts. You blinded suckers are happy with Obama, thank God I am in the DR and will not have to pay back the 1.5 MILLION in debt per family of four that you will have to. You will be happy when he next pres. in 4 years when Obama is kicked out for being the greatest failure in 200 years, will have to DOUBLE ALL YOUR TAXESand yu pay for his stupidity.

Did you know that right now, if Obama took every dollar earned by every American, he would not be ableto pay for his deficit spending? So who will? He has a bigger deficit than all presidens on 200 years, and one that is 3-4 times larger than Bush's. What a total idiot commie!

As for CAnada, being a much smarter lot, our bansk stayed out of the whole debt swap thing the other countries banks got into. Back in the 90's we passed legsialtion preventing our banks from getting into the USA made mess. So our bansk are strong and sound. House across Canada actually went up in value in the past two years when USA houses dropped by as much as 50%. Our banks did not make stupid loans on inflated values on houses so we avoided the housing bubble. I still have development property in Canada and I thnak God it is not in the USA!

Sure I love to point out how diff. we are as Canadians![/COLOR]
[/QUOTE]
[B]
[COLOR=#ED1C24]Red Neck... I have an MBA and can spot garbage like this a mile away. Stats can be manipulated for any argument douche. The last eight years broke this country- in general increases in spending while incomes dropped for most Americans, coupled with the AIG debacle (this was where no governmental oversight comes into play) have created this world wide crises. All the while the Bush's and Cheneys of the world made a killing. Brown and Root et al.

Banks we're giving away mortgages, people in credit card debt got more cards in the mail- and the debt ball grew- banks sold said debt times over- where the hell was the SEC? And what about Enron?? Obama is working to fix it and I hope he does, as the right has done NOTHING to solve this crisis. They seem to be more interested in having the President and Government fail than offering solutions. There needs to be oversight and these institutions need to be regulated for their own good. Not one solid republican rebuttal has been offered up!! And as you are Canadian living in the DR I will certainly not come to you for advice. So stop hating on Obama and keep an eye on the Sanky's at your place douchebag.

Want me to break it down? The only way to get out of the hole we are in is to rebuild. Our economy is stagnant- even W recognized that in order to stimulate the economy, the government would have to put some money in people's pockets. (Stimulus checks) But it was too little too late. If you can step out of your incredible charts and hack garbage, you may be able to think linearly and see what has to be done. In order to jump start the economy, we need to put more money in people's pockets- i.e. tax cuts, job development (infrastructure), and regulation. When you build a house to you start with the roof? NO bottom up... Scale back Bushie's lack of taxes on the top 1%- tax them, relieve the tax burden on the middle class thus promoting the establishment of this country's economic marrow- the small business.

BTW- I absolutely love Canadians, great drinkers, great people- I have lifelong friends fraternity brothers at McGill. I envy their education system to be honest. But, you Billy, need to come work and live in the US as part of the middle class to see what really has been going on- until then cut the crap. [/COLOR][B][/B][/B]
[/QUOTE]

I agree the middle class in the USA is screwed, and the rich way over taxed. As for MBA's, they are not worth much these days and many people prefer to hire people without one....I do have a couple of friends in the USA - mostly business owners but also somne regular joes.

As for stats, sure, but those charts cannot be maniuplated - they are factual - you can twist the deductions but not the most baisc fact:

The USA began the buy now pay later scheme when I was a kid int he 60's! I saw the first signs in the windows. That borrow and spend is what has killed a once mighty nation, along with the $70 an hour for a guy to put 4 bolts on a car. And the economy cannot rebound until the debt is reigned in.

One of the charts has a interesting sign -while savings dropped for 10 years in the uSA, in the last year they started to go up.

[/QUOTE]

MBA's? Well its a good thing I'm doing well... I disagree Bill, debt can be held even managed during a bear market, look back to your hero Reagan, who i can blame all this on. He encountered a pretty serious and dormant economy- double dip recession, double digit inflation etc... What happened? He increased government spending, a quarter more than when he took office by the time he left- tripling the countries debt. It is proven, debt won't break you- unwillingness to put money back into the economy will. Granted Obama's solutions will not solve this overnight, he is taking the proper measures, debt can be reigned in with a stronger economy ala Bill Clinton.
[/QUOTE]


I agree debt will not break a country if it is reasonable and an investment. Reagan saved the USA. Clinton coasted on what Reagan accomplished. BUt how much debt is reasonable? The lefty spenders (and Bush was a lefty spender) are about to find out.

The Titianic was not supposed to be sinkable, even by God (big mistake saying that) but it went down.

Obama took over the Titanic 10 min. aqfter it hit the iceburg. His idea of saving the Titanic is to steer right into a bigger icerburg on the other side

[/QUOTE]

Funny you just said and i quote: "And the economy cannot rebound until the debt is reigned in."

This statement is false, as I proved with my Reagan example. Many say Reagan's was coasting on Carter as it was Carters appointee at the fed Paul Volcker. Nonetheless I'll let that slide. Did you forget there was a Pres. between Reagan and Clinton? Anywho... Clinton remember oversaw the largest economic expansion in the history of the country no thanks to Reagan or the republicans. Consider this my man:

Enacted the 1993 Deficit Reduction Plan without a Single Republican Vote.
Negotiated the Balanced Budget Agreement of 1997
Dedicated the Surplus to Save Social Security and Reduce the National Debt

Just to name a few. He did away with the Republican mess he was voted in to fix. Simply, he put more money in peoples pockets:

Lowest Federal Income Tax Burden in 35 Years
Higher Incomes even after Taxes and Inflation
Expanded the Earned Income Tax Credit
Created the $500 per Child Tax Credit

Money people turned around and spent- namely on computers. Simple, a strong economy enabled the government to turn around have the largest $$$$urplus in history. Again it is proven.

Now as to your last question: "how much debt is reasonable?" I don't know to be honest. But history tell us that "fiscal conservatives" are at fault.


[IMG]http://blogs.venturacountystar.com/greenberg/archives/2008/08/deficits.html[/IMG]

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Amazing- more statistical garbage. First off Obama signed into law the largest tax CUT in history.
A crappy article written by right wing hacks!

I am amazed at Red Neck Bill here, These "charts" all prove what an awful job the previous president did- as Obama did not take office till 2009- evey chart is pre '09. I support my president- and again Bill you are full of sh1t!! Talk to me aboot Canada eh!
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[COLOR=#2F3699]Crayy article? Hmm, The truth hurts. All the man did was point out some basic facts and you go nuts?

Typical of any liberal left wing nut. You are not cabale of linear thinking and when confronted with truth you do not like you get all angry and bothered

If you have cared to read or been able to understand, you would know that the charts and article deals with the past 60 (get that ignoramous? SIXTY years of history) and it does not blame Bush or Obama for the problem. It does make it clear that when you are bankrupt as a gov. it is plain STUPID (as any 10 year old knows) to run huge deficits and give tax cuts. You blinded suckers are happy with Obama, thank God I am in the DR and will not have to pay back the 1.5 MILLION in debt per family of four that you will have to. You will be happy when he next pres. in 4 years when Obama is kicked out for being the greatest failure in 200 years, will have to DOUBLE ALL YOUR TAXESand yu pay for his stupidity.

Did you know that right now, if Obama took every dollar earned by every American, he would not be ableto pay for his deficit spending? So who will? He has a bigger deficit than all presidens on 200 years, and one that is 3-4 times larger than Bush's. What a total idiot commie!

As for CAnada, being a much smarter lot, our bansk stayed out of the whole debt swap thing the other countries banks got into. Back in the 90's we passed legsialtion preventing our banks from getting into the USA made mess. So our bansk are strong and sound. House across Canada actually went up in value in the past two years when USA houses dropped by as much as 50%. Our banks did not make stupid loans on inflated values on houses so we avoided the housing bubble. I still have development property in Canada and I thnak God it is not in the USA!

Sure I love to point out how diff. we are as Canadians![/COLOR]
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[COLOR=#ED1C24]Red Neck... I have an MBA and can spot garbage like this a mile away. Stats can be manipulated for any argument douche. The last eight years broke this country- in general increases in spending while incomes dropped for most Americans, coupled with the AIG debacle (this was where no governmental oversight comes into play) have created this world wide crises. All the while the Bush's and Cheneys of the world made a killing. Brown and Root et al.

Banks we're giving away mortgages, people in credit card debt got more cards in the mail- and the debt ball grew- banks sold said debt times over- where the hell was the SEC? And what about Enron?? Obama is working to fix it and I hope he does, as the right has done NOTHING to solve this crisis. They seem to be more interested in having the President and Government fail than offering solutions. There needs to be oversight and these institutions need to be regulated for their own good. Not one solid republican rebuttal has been offered up!! And as you are Canadian living in the DR I will certainly not come to you for advice. So stop hating on Obama and keep an eye on the Sanky's at your place douchebag.

Want me to break it down? The only way to get out of the hole we are in is to rebuild. Our economy is stagnant- even W recognized that in order to stimulate the economy, the government would have to put some money in people's pockets. (Stimulus checks) But it was too little too late. If you can step out of your incredible charts and hack garbage, you may be able to think linearly and see what has to be done. In order to jump start the economy, we need to put more money in people's pockets- i.e. tax cuts, job development (infrastructure), and regulation. When you build a house to you start with the roof? NO bottom up... Scale back Bushie's lack of taxes on the top 1%- tax them, relieve the tax burden on the middle class thus promoting the establishment of this country's economic marrow- the small business.

BTW- I absolutely love Canadians, great drinkers, great people- I have lifelong friends fraternity brothers at McGill. I envy their education system to be honest. But, you Billy, need to come work and live in the US as part of the middle class to see what really has been going on- until then cut the crap. [/COLOR][B][/B][/B]
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I agree the middle class in the USA is screwed, and the rich way over taxed. As for MBA's, they are not worth much these days and many people prefer to hire people without one....I do have a couple of friends in the USA - mostly business owners but also somne regular joes.

As for stats, sure, but those charts cannot be maniuplated - they are factual - you can twist the deductions but not the most baisc fact:

The USA began the buy now pay later scheme when I was a kid int he 60's! I saw the first signs in the windows. That borrow and spend is what has killed a once mighty nation, along with the $70 an hour for a guy to put 4 bolts on a car. And the economy cannot rebound until the debt is reigned in.

One of the charts has a interesting sign -while savings dropped for 10 years in the uSA, in the last year they started to go up.

[/QUOTE]

MBA's? Well its a good thing I'm doing well... I disagree Bill, debt can be held even managed during a bear market, look back to your hero Reagan, who i can blame all this on. He encountered a pretty serious and dormant economy- double dip recession, double digit inflation etc... What happened? He increased government spending, a quarter more than when he took office by the time he left- tripling the countries debt. It is proven, debt won't break you- unwillingness to put money back into the economy will. Granted Obama's solutions will not solve this overnight, he is taking the proper measures, debt can be reigned in with a stronger economy ala Bill Clinton.
[/QUOTE]


I agree debt will not break a country if it is reasonable and an investment. Reagan saved the USA. Clinton coasted on what Reagan accomplished. BUt how much debt is reasonable? The lefty spenders (and Bush was a lefty spender) are about to find out.

The Titianic was not supposed to be sinkable, even by God (big mistake saying that) but it went down.

Obama took over the Titanic 10 min. aqfter it hit the iceburg. His idea of saving the Titanic is to steer right into a bigger icerburg on the other side

[/QUOTE]

Funny you just said and i quote: "And the economy cannot rebound until the debt is reigned in."

This statement is false, as I proved with my Reagan example. Many say Reagan's was coasting on Carter as it was Carters appointee at the fed Paul Volcker. Nonetheless I'll let that slide. Did you forget there was a Pres. between Reagan and Clinton? Anywho... Clinton remember oversaw the largest economic expansion in the history of the country no thanks to Reagan or the republicans. Consider this my man:

Enacted the 1993 Deficit Reduction Plan without a Single Republican Vote.
Negotiated the Balanced Budget Agreement of 1997
Dedicated the Surplus to Save Social Security and Reduce the National Debt

Just to name a few. He did away with the Republican mess he was voted in to fix. Simply, he put more money in peoples pockets:

Lowest Federal Income Tax Burden in 35 Years
Higher Incomes even after Taxes and Inflation
Expanded the Earned Income Tax Credit
Created the $500 per Child Tax Credit

Money people turned around and spent- namely on computers. Simple, a strong economy enabled the government to turn around have the largest $$$$urplus in history. Again it is proven.

Now as to your last question: "how much debt is reasonable?" I don't know to be honest. But history tell us that "fiscal conservatives" are at fault.


[IMG]http://blogs.venturacountystar.com/greenberg/archives/2008/08/deficits.html[/IMG]



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Try New Zealand - about 36 years back more or less. They hit the debt wall. 25% unemployment. The got rid oif all unions. That is where the USA is headed.
"how much debt is reasonable?"
If you do not know how much, who does?

BTW - economists see Reagan as the guy who tuned it around. Clinton coasted on what he did.

No one knows, that's why we need to hope for the best and see what happens... We've been through this before, let's wait and see

We have never been through this before, never. Global village, job shift to Asia, USA debt etc.

never

A well written open letter from a concerned US citizen, Janet Contreras. Here is the text. I wish I could express myself as well as she did. It is well worth reading and comprehending;


"A letter from a woman in Arizona. She writes an open letter to our nation's leadership:

I'm a home grown American citizen, 53, registered Democrat all my life. Before the last presidential election I registered as a Republican because I no longer felt the Democratic Party represents my views or works to pursue issues important to me. Now I no longer feel the Republican Party represents my views or works to pursue issues important to me. The fact is I no longer feel any political party or representative in Washington represents my views or works to pursue the issues important to me. There must be someone. Please tell me who you are. Please stand up and tell me that you are there and that you're willing to fight for our Constitution as it was written. Please stand up now. You might ask yourself what my views and issues are that I would horribly feel so disenfranchised by both major political parties. What kind of nut job am I? Will you please tell me?

Well, these are briefly my views and issues for which I seek representation:

One, illegal immigration. I want you to stop coddling illegal immigrants and secure our borders. Close the underground tunnels. Stop the violence and the trafficking in drugs and people. No amnesty, not again. Been there, done that, no resolution. P.S., I'm not a racist. This isn't to be confused with legal immigration.

Two, the TARP bill, I want it repealed and I want no further funding supplied to it. We told you no, but you did it anyway. I want the remaining unfunded 95% repealed. Freeze, repeal.

Three: Czars, I want the circumvention of our checks and balances stopped immediately. Fire the czars. No more czars. Government officials answer to the process, not to the president. Stop trampling on our Constitution and honor it.

Four, cap and trade. The debate on global warming is not over. There is more to say.

Five, universal healthcare. I will not be rushed into another expensive decision. Don't you dare try to pass this in the middle of the night and then go on break. Slow down!

Six, growing government control. I want states rights and sovereignty fully restored. I want less government in my life, not more. Shrink it down. Mind your own business. You have enough to take care of with your real obligations. Why don't you start there.

Seven, ACORN. I do not want ACORN and its affiliates in charge of our 2010 census. I want them investigated. I also do not want mandatory escrow fees contributed to them every time on every real estate deal that closes. Stop the funding to ACORN and its affiliates pending impartial audits and investigations. I do not trust them with taking the census over with our taxpayer money. I don't trust them with our taxpayer money. Face up to the allegations against them and get it resolved before taxpayers get any more involved with them. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, hello. Stop protecting your political buddies. You work for us, the people. Investigate.

Eight, redistribution of wealth. No, no, no. I work for my money. It is mine. I have always worked for people with more money than I have because they gave me jobs. That is the only redistribution of wealth that I will support. I never got a job from a poor person. Why do you want me to hate my employers? Why what do you have against shareholders making a profit?

Nine, charitable contributions. Although I never got a job from a poor person, I have helped many in need. Charity belongs in our local communities, where we know our needs best and can use our local talent and our local resources. Butt out, please. We want to do it ourselves.

Ten, corporate bailouts. Knock it off. Sink or swim like the rest of us. If there are hard times ahead, we'll be better off just getting into it and letting the strong survive. Quick and painful. Have you ever ripped off a Band Aid? We will pull together. Great things happen in America under great hardship. Give us the chance to innovate. We cannot disappoint you more than you have disappointed us.

Eleven, transparency and accountability. How about it? No, really, how about it? Let's have it. Let's say we give the buzzwords a rest and have some straight honest talk. Please try please stop manipulating and trying to appease me with clever wording. I am not the idiot you obviously take me for. Stop sneaking around and meeting in back rooms making deals with your friends. It will only be a prelude to your criminal investigation. Stop hiding things from me.

Twelve, unprecedented quick spending. Stop it now.

Take a breath. Listen to the people. Let's just slow down and get some input from some nonpoliticians on the subject. Stop making everything an emergency. Stop speed reading our bills into law. I am not an activist. I am not a community organizer. Nor am I a terrorist, a militant or a violent person. I am a parent and a grandparent. I work. I'm busy. I'm busy. I am busy, and I am tired. I thought we elected competent people to take care of the business of government so that we could work, raise our families, pay our bills, have a little recreation, complain about taxes, endure our hardships, pursue our personal goals, cut our lawn, wash our cars on the weekends and be responsible contributing members of society and teach our children to be the same all while living in the home of the free and land of the brave.