Dominican Today Forum » Living in the DR » General Info » Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
#11 - Posted 7 October 2009, 11:52 AM
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
USADR previously said:

For Dominicans who either live in DR or travel their often, I got this question asked on another forum :

-How common is dating between Dominicans and Haitians?
-How common is marriage between Dominicans and Haitians?
-How common are mixed Dominican/Haitians in DR?
-How common are Haitians becoming citizens?
-Are Haitians becoming absorbed into the Dominican mainstream society, or is it more similar to the Bahamas in which they make up a distinct ethnic minority?

1- Not common....happens but it's not common at all,
2- Not common........same as above,
3- Not common.......same as above,
4- Not common......Most Haitians are illegal so becoming Citizens is out of the question,
5- ABSOLUTELY NOT.......Haitians rather stick with their own.

I am The BOOO!!GEYMAN...Hide The Kids And Stop The VELORIO, The Dancing, The Singing, The Whining, The Nagging, The Complaining and LLORADERA....El LEONAAAAAAAAZO De Villa Duarte is Here!.
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#12 - Posted 7 October 2009, 12:13 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Cabarete
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
USADR previously said:

For Dominicans who either live in DR or travel their often, I got this question asked on another forum :

-How common is dating between Dominicans and Haitians?
-How common is marriage between Dominicans and Haitians?
-How common are mixed Dominican/Haitians in DR?
-How common are Haitians becoming citizens?
-Are Haitians becoming absorbed into the Dominican mainstream society?
-Or is it more similar to the Bahamas in which they make up a distinct ethnic minority?


Dating and marriages between Dominicans and Haitians are very common, but not openly nor proudly broadcast. Quite commonly but not to greater extent beyond the known fact that yes, Haitian still make up a distinct ethnic minority in DR. As well as to also say indeed, yes Haitians are becoming absorbed into the Dominican mainstream since most of the young generations being born there do not quite identify with so much being Haitian

Traditionally, the youngsters do not live fully the Haitian culture or value within DR whom are often perceived by many as Dominicans anyways much like naturally you would have any ethnic groups populating in the United States. Thus, it is common that there are mixed Dominican and Haitian living in DR from both ever since the old ages to understandably even today. Keep in mind, per presumptuous assumed premises that are widely misconceived that one of affluent Spanish speaking or light skinned hues are often regarded or misrepresented as not Haitians. Unless of course they lead a a given stereotypical stigmatized lifestyle that the certain common psyche of some Dominicans tend to deem, characterize or perceive as to be Haitian.

Haitians have been becoming citizens of DR since old ages to even today, however it is not your average poor migrated Haitians who gets to become citizens as such process is financially costly and often the approval process has rather been practiced under certain discriminatory discretion by granting only to those who seem to fit a certain caste of elitist social class appearance and status unlike past Dominican constitutions used to grant one such a process more deliberately.

P.S: Often the sons and daughters of the Haitian riches, politicians (to include past exiled, corrupted and even current politicians with pull) and indeed to no assuage matter of being surprised, the Haitian mixed mulattoes who have decided to reside in DR are easily get granted citizenship and merge right into the Dominican elites as almost Dominicans and never have to feel nor find it relevant to say they are Haitians.
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#13 - Posted 7 October 2009, 12:34 PM
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
TanBellaMami previously said:

Quote:
USADR previously said:

For Dominicans who either live in DR or travel their often, I got this question asked on another forum :

-How common is dating between Dominicans and Haitians?
-How common is marriage between Dominicans and Haitians?
-How common are mixed Dominican/Haitians in DR?
-How common are Haitians becoming citizens?
-Are Haitians becoming absorbed into the Dominican mainstream society?
-Or is it more similar to the Bahamas in which they make up a distinct ethnic minority?


Dating and marriages between Dominicans and Haitians are very common, but not openly nor proudly broadcast. Quite commonly but not to greater extent beyond the known fact that yes, Haitian still make up a distinct ethnic minority in DR. As well as to also say indeed, yes Haitians are becoming absorbed into the Dominican mainstream since most of the young generations being born there do not quite identify with so much being Haitian

Traditionally, the youngsters do not live fully the Haitian culture or value within DR whom are often perceived by many as Dominicans anyways much like naturally you would have any ethnic groups populating in the United States. Thus, it is common that there are mixed Dominican and Haitian living in DR from both ever since the old ages to understandably even today. Keep in mind, per presumptuous assumed premises that are widely misconceived that one of affluent Spanish speaking or light skinned hues are often regarded or misrepresented as not Haitians. Unless of course they lead a a given stereotypical stigmatized lifestyle that the certain common psyche of some Dominicans tend to deem, characterize or perceive as to be Haitian.

Haitians have been becoming citizens of DR since old ages to even today, however it is not your average poor migrated Haitians who gets to become citizens as such process is financially costly and often the approval process has rather been practiced under certain discriminatory discretion by granting only to those who seem to fit a certain caste of elitist social class appearance and status unlike past Dominican constitutions used to grant one such a process more deliberately.

P.S: Often the sons and daughters of the Haitian riches, politicians (to include past exiled, corrupted and even current politicians with pull) and indeed to no assuage matter of being surprised, the Haitian mixed mulattoes who have decided to reside in DR are easily get granted citizenship and merge right into the Dominican elites as almost Dominicans and never have to feel nor find it relevant to say they are Haitians.


Can you please stop repeating yourself. While your post may make sense to multiple posts here in your opinion, it could be stated only once.

And it is not VERY common, to say so is ludicrous. At that point it wouldn't need to be broadcast because you'd have all these Haitians in family lines.
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#14 - Posted 7 October 2009, 12:41 PM
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
TuPapaupa previously said:


1- Not common....happens but it's not common at all,
2- Not common........same as above,
3- Not common.......same as above,
4- Not common......Most Haitians are illegal so becoming Citizens is out of the question,
5- ABSOLUTELY NOT.......Haitians rather stick with their own.



TuPapaupa,

I am sorry to say you are quite wrong, but I can still agree with you only under the premise of the sense that whatever the percentage you think is or is not common falls into the category of feared social reprising disownment by some other fellow more resentful Dominican peers. That is not true that "Haitians stick to or with their own" There could not have been a more misconceived notion such as this.

If anything much like DR, there a lot of Haitians much like blacks anywhere who tend to love the idea of intermarriages with other creed with and of Europeans characteristic due to what they feel in mind society has told them to be desirable features thus the typical trendy of common societal conditioning insecurities.

Most of the Haitians that are illegals or are considered undocumented in DR are those Haitians from Haitian peasant provinces that seriously lack or let us just say "do not" have established Administrative infrastructures to be able to have the required items of documentation which would have deemed them documented on DR's soil as per DR's constitution states.

Such only required items are as follow and can be in either a combination of but not limited to, or under required possession of either, and or or:

-- A valid Haitian Identification Card.
-- A valid Haitian Passport.
-- A legitimate Birth Certificates.

As such, those documentations are required to must be recognizable by both Government institutions on the island as per agreeable foreign policies relations between the two nations do not so much "per say" claim those individuals to be illegals. That is why you see the word "Undocumented" or "In Transition" are rather often used.
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#15 - Posted 7 October 2009, 12:51 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Santo Domingo
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
ElTorodeCibao previously said:

Quote:
TanBellaMami previously said:

Quote:
USADR previously said:

For Dominicans who either live in DR or travel their often, I got this question asked on another forum :

-How common is dating between Dominicans and Haitians?
-How common is marriage between Dominicans and Haitians?
-How common are mixed Dominican/Haitians in DR?
-How common are Haitians becoming citizens?
-Are Haitians becoming absorbed into the Dominican mainstream society?
-Or is it more similar to the Bahamas in which they make up a distinct ethnic minority?


Dating and marriages between Dominicans and Haitians are very common, but not openly nor proudly broadcast. Quite commonly but not to greater extent beyond the known fact that yes, Haitian still make up a distinct ethnic minority in DR. As well as to also say indeed, yes Haitians are becoming absorbed into the Dominican mainstream since most of the young generations being born there do not quite identify with so much being Haitian

Traditionally, the youngsters do not live fully the Haitian culture or value within DR whom are often perceived by many as Dominicans anyways much like naturally you would have any ethnic groups populating in the United States. Thus, it is common that there are mixed Dominican and Haitian living in DR from both ever since the old ages to understandably even today. Keep in mind, per presumptuous assumed premises that are widely misconceived that one of affluent Spanish speaking or light skinned hues are often regarded or misrepresented as not Haitians. Unless of course they lead a a given stereotypical stigmatized lifestyle that the certain common psyche of some Dominicans tend to deem, characterize or perceive as to be Haitian.

Haitians have been becoming citizens of DR since old ages to even today, however it is not your average poor migrated Haitians who gets to become citizens as such process is financially costly and often the approval process has rather been practiced under certain discriminatory discretion by granting only to those who seem to fit a certain caste of elitist social class appearance and status unlike past Dominican constitutions used to grant one such a process more deliberately.

P.S: Often the sons and daughters of the Haitian riches, politicians (to include past exiled, corrupted and even current politicians with pull) and indeed to no assuage matter of being surprised, the Haitian mixed mulattoes who have decided to reside in DR are easily get granted citizenship and merge right into the Dominican elites as almost Dominicans and never have to feel nor find it relevant to say they are Haitians.


Can you please stop repeating yourself. While your post may make sense to multiple posts here in your opinion, it could be stated only once.

And it is not VERY common, to say so is ludicrous. At that point it wouldn't need to be broadcast because you'd have all these Haitians in family lines.


Exactly. And besides, if those marriages were as common as he puts them, they would be really visible by now. Instead, all evidence points out to the fact that all the efforts of the common haitian inmigrant on foot in this country are geared toward getting their sweethearts out of their afflicted country. Trust me, during the 2004-2009 period, the majority of the haitian inmigrants on this country have been males, but there's a rising female inmigration trend going on as we speak. I consider this to be more than enough evidence to support my theory. This would not be happening if they were really being regaled with flowers and tenderness by the local dominican female population.
Edited on 10/7/2009 1:29 PM by Lautaro.
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#16 - Posted 7 October 2009, 1:01 PM
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
ElTorodeCibao previously said:


And it is not VERY common, to say so is ludicrous. At that point it wouldn't need to be broadcast because you'd have all these Haitians in family lines.



Oddly or funny enough, what many Dominicans may fear to omit is that there are well many families within the Dominican society whom have some Haitian blood lineage roots, but have managed to traditionally suppress such a knowledge due to of course known cultural resentments, Anti-Haitiasmo and xenophobic pride.

Hardly ever you will find a Dominican to proudly come forward and admit that he or she may have Haitian lineage and logically of course it is understandable due to known reasons listed above... Thus stating or finding that such common practice of Dominicans and Haitians intermarriages to be ludicrous is actually quite perfectly understandable and even expected to be such a reaction by us most Dominicans. I mean, who can can actually blame them since many are thought in DR through known tales that the worse thing one can ever be is Haitian.

Much like my mother when she was growing up in DR she tells us how she used to hear even frequent folkloric tales and jokes "Run, the Haitians are coming" as if in those tales the Haitian was the bogeyman which was something that was merged into Dominican folklore given the time during the known historical Haitian invasions and attempts.
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#17 - Posted 7 October 2009, 1:07 PM
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
.
Edited on 10/7/2009 1:07 PM by ElTorodeCibao.
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#18 - Posted 7 October 2009, 1:22 PM
Location: United States, "El Amanza GUAPOS, BIGOTS, TROLLS, LLORONAS y SELF-PROCLAIMED DOMINICAN "PATRIOTS" De Villa Duarte"
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
TanBellaMami previously said:

Quote:
TuPapaupa previously said:


1- Not common....happens but it's not common at all,
2- Not common........same as above,
3- Not common.......same as above,
4- Not common......Most Haitians are illegal so becoming Citizens is out of the question,
5- ABSOLUTELY NOT.......Haitians rather stick with their own.



TuPapaupa,

I am sorry to say you are quite wrong, but I can still agree with you only under the premise of the sense that whatever the percentage you think is or is not common falls into the category of feared social reprising disownment by some other fellow more resentful Dominican peers. That is not true that "Haitians stick to or with their own" There could not have been a more misconceived notion such as this.

If anything much like DR, there a lot of Haitians much like blacks anywhere who tend to love the idea of intermarriages with other creed with and of Europeans characteristic due to what they feel in mind society has told them to be desirable features thus the typical trendy of common societal conditioning insecurities.

Most of the Haitians that are illegals or are considered undocumented in DR are those Haitians from Haitian peasant provinces that seriously lack or let us just say "do not" have established Administrative infrastructures to be able to have the required items of documentation which would have deemed them documented on DR's soil as per DR's constitution states.

Such only required items are as follow and can be in either a combination of but not limited to, or under required possession of either, and or or:

-- A valid Haitian Identification Card.
-- A valid Haitian Passport.
-- A legitimate Birth Certificates.

As such, those documentations are required to must be recognizable by both Government institutions on the island as per agreeable foreign policies relations between the two nations do not so much "per say" claim those individuals to be illegals. That is why you see the word "Undocumented" or "In Transition" are rather often used.

Not the first nor last time someone disagrees with me........

I hope you do know that there are SOME (NOTE: "SOME" Dominicans that don't want to associate themselves with Haitians, right?.

Well, SOME (NOTE: "SOME" Dominicans, when they associate with Haitians, they get "labeled"......and since SOME (NOTE: "SOME) Dominicans do not like to be labeled, they rather stay away from Haitians........

So noooooo, it's not common to see Dominicans-Haitians marriages/dating.........perhaps they hide it......perhaps because they don't want to be "labeled".

I am The BOOO!!GEYMAN...Hide The Kids And Stop The VELORIO, The Dancing, The Singing, The Whining, The Nagging, The Complaining and LLORADERA....El LEONAAAAAAAAZO De Villa Duarte is Here!.
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#19 - Posted 7 October 2009, 1:31 PM
Location: Dominican Republic, Santo Domingo
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
TuPapaupa previously said:

Quote:
TanBellaMami previously said:

Quote:
TuPapaupa previously said:


1- Not common....happens but it's not common at all,
2- Not common........same as above,
3- Not common.......same as above,
4- Not common......Most Haitians are illegal so becoming Citizens is out of the question,
5- ABSOLUTELY NOT.......Haitians rather stick with their own.



TuPapaupa,

I am sorry to say you are quite wrong, but I can still agree with you only under the premise of the sense that whatever the percentage you think is or is not common falls into the category of feared social reprising disownment by some other fellow more resentful Dominican peers. That is not true that "Haitians stick to or with their own" There could not have been a more misconceived notion such as this.

If anything much like DR, there a lot of Haitians much like blacks anywhere who tend to love the idea of intermarriages with other creed with and of Europeans characteristic due to what they feel in mind society has told them to be desirable features thus the typical trendy of common societal conditioning insecurities.

Most of the Haitians that are illegals or are considered undocumented in DR are those Haitians from Haitian peasant provinces that seriously lack or let us just say "do not" have established Administrative infrastructures to be able to have the required items of documentation which would have deemed them documented on DR's soil as per DR's constitution states.

Such only required items are as follow and can be in either a combination of but not limited to, or under required possession of either, and or or:

-- A valid Haitian Identification Card.
-- A valid Haitian Passport.
-- A legitimate Birth Certificates.

As such, those documentations are required to must be recognizable by both Government institutions on the island as per agreeable foreign policies relations between the two nations do not so much "per say" claim those individuals to be illegals. That is why you see the word "Undocumented" or "In Transition" are rather often used.

Not the first nor last time someone disagrees with me........

I hope you do know that there are SOME (NOTE: "SOME" Dominicans that don't want to associate themselves with Haitians, right?.

Well, SOME (NOTE: "SOME" Dominicans, when they associate with Haitians, they get "labeled"......and since SOME (NOTE: "SOME) Dominicans do not like to be labeled, they rather stay away from Haitians........

So noooooo, it's not common to see Dominicans-Haitians marriages/dating.........perhaps they hide it......perhaps because they don't want to be "labeled".


Besides, despite the stereotype portraying them as "putas" and "easy pickings" seen on foreign lands, dominican females are even more selective and discriminative at the time of choosing their significant other, more than us males will ever be. If something, I'm willing to bet that the dominican/haitian marriages out there are more on the side of dominican male/haitian female than the other way around.
Edited on 10/7/2009 1:32 PM by Lautaro.
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#20 - Posted 7 October 2009, 1:35 PM
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RE: Question to Dominicans about Haitians becoming Dominican citizens
Quote:
Lautaro previously said:

Exactly, and besides, if those marriages were as common as he puts them, they would be really visible by now.

Instead, all evidence points out to the fact that all the efforts of the common haitian inmigrant on foot in this country are geared toward getting their sweethearts out of their afflicted country.

Trust me, during the 2004-2009 period, the majority of the haitian inmigrants on this country have been males, but there's a rising female inmigration trend going on as we speak. I consider this to be more than enough evidence to support my theory.


What is visible or not visible to be common or not, still very much so depends or varies on the common shared acceptance or non-acceptance of a certain practice.

And as to what the main populace of certain society truly fear or embrace, condemn or condone the terms of the words "reluctance" come to mind, but even reluctance is not in definition total dismissive of such any practices given whatever their obliged systematic "maronage" might be due to known lack of acceptance or in-acceptance of what are deem normal or ab within certain society. My argument still stands that such practice are taking place whether one wishes to claim it to be common or not.

In essence, the actual speedy rate process or visually apparent nature of the practice itself is not so much what is in question here. This is not a case one can measure solemnly on assumed statistic within a culture where the practice itself culturally is viewed with such negative regards.

P.S: In other words, whatever theory one may have on the argument, much leverage for open disclosure seemingly are not likely encouraged with any particular great receptance but rather with scrutinized criticism, belittling and downing given the known prejudice of the practice itself firmly wherein exists.
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