josean and chill let this be a warning to you....one mistake from you or your kind and it will be an @ss kicking for you guys

I can't tell for sure, but that picture looks more like the Kearsarge, one of the murder boats of the US imperialists, than the picture shown yesterday.

The killer boat "conducts maneuvers along the Dominican capital’s seaside boulevard El Malecon, as part of a medical assistance mission," the DT reports.

So, the "maneuvers" are part a "medical assistance mission." That's so incongruous.

The "medical assistance mission" is more likely a cover for the maneuvers of a boat designed assault amphibiously a large city.

This seems to be historic policy and posture of the US imperialists toward LA/C "Speak, dear boy, ever so softly, but carry a big, heavy stick to knock the Spanish out of them."

This "medical assistance mission" plays the role of soft speech, the maneuver the big stick.

If, in the future, the US imperialists order the Kearsarge to go in, the Dominican naval base at Calderas may be the first place the Kearsarge takes and holds.

Soaring above the free market, US Treasury may pay US individuals and institutions $25,000 for a bond based on bad mortgages. The $25,000 was the price of the bond at the time of issuance.

But the market value of the bond is now about a nickel because homeowners are supposed to pay interest on the bond and the principal upon maturity. But millions of the homeowners have lost their homes by foreclosures. Therefore the interest and principal will never be paid; hence, the market value of the bond at a nickel.

Dominican individuals and institutions own a lot of these US bonds based on bad US mortgages because they refused to listen to Hugo Chavez who warned them about that stuff.

BUSH: Leonel, how do you like my boat, the Kearsarge.

LF: It's real big.

BUSH: Leonel, are you going to ask for a nickel or $25,000?

LF:When will the boat leave?

Since Bear Stearn, Lehman Bros, Merrill Lynch, Wachovia Securities, JP Morgan/Chase, Bank of America, Citigroup, IMF, WB, IADB, and other imperial swindlers pushed the bad US bonds [ "MBSs" ] based bad US mortgages on Dominicans -- the state, central bank, the commercial banks, pensions, wealthy individuals, the capital reserves of Dominican businesses, etc., it's safe to guesstimate the US financial sector sold at least 100,000 bad bonds to Dominican customers at $25,000 a pop.

"Why you put your money US Treasuries for only 4% while MBSs are almost as safe as Treasuries but MBSs pay from 6% to 10% if you shop around."

So, the Dominicans may have coughed up about $2.5 billion for bad US bonds.

Bush wants the Dominicans to quietly take the hit without reimbursement of any kind.

"There better not be any noise or trouble in my backyard," Bush warns.

"You see that boat? Do you know what that boat can do to you? Are you going to sit down and be quiet?"

Belial states erroneously-The "medical assistance mission" is more likely a cover for the maneuvers of a boat designed assault amphibiously a large city.

The Kearsarge is a LHD nothing amphibious about it

Before their massive investments in bad US bonds called MBSs, Dominicans used to love to observe their bank and securities accounts to see whether the balances rose or fell. Now, they observe the killer boat as choppers land and take off.

oooo

http://www.abn.info.ve/go_news5.php?articulo=151783&lee=17

The Venezuelan National Assembly created a commission to analyze the US financial crisis and its consequences.

Moreover, President Hugo Chávez said the world's financial crisis is due to capitalism, “which works like a cancer that undermines society and makes impossible a life that has a path and opportunities.”

Chávez also made clear that Venezuela is " armored " against foreign economic irregularities.

“Our economy is independent from the so-called neo-liberal financial architecture and from the capitalistic financial institutions,” he explained.

Santiago/Miami
Although I often read many of the opinions posted on this page -- I seldom chime in since most of the comments are generally harmless. Belial's input, however, is so far off the mark that I thought it appropriate to put in my two cents. I'm Dominican, Cibaeno in fact -- and also happen to be a retired U.S. Naval Officer who served for over 24 years. While it is true that I have not a clue as to where Belial gets his information, I can tell you from personal experience that one of the most benevolent organizations in the U.S. Government is the Department of Defence -- in particular the U.S. Navy. You see, we understand that building good relationships takes more than launching missiles -- it takes goodwill and genuine care for the less fortunate. Throughout my active career, I found myself off the coast of many nations providing the same type of humanitarian support that the KEARSARGE is providing in DR. Belial, you sound smart, but your paranoia is a detractor.

"The Kearsarge is a LHD nothing amphibious about it," Tex declares in a very bizarre manner.

0000

"Amphibious" refers to a military capacity or operation "executed by coordinated action of land, sea, and air forces organized for invasion."
http://reference.aol.com/dictiona....=amphibious&lookupbtn=Look+Up

The Kearsarge has 1900 marines as its "land" force.

The sea-going boat itself is its "sea" force.

The half dozen jets and about 50 choppers are its "air" force.

The current maneuvers aim to improve coodinated action among its land, sea, and air forces.

"LHD" stands for "Landing Helicopter Dock," a US Navy hull classification term, specifically for amphibious assault ships.

Tex, perhaps, I don't understand your point. Can you explain what you mean?

Montesino,

Hear hear. It is people who post comments like his that can not see the forrest for the trees and are blinded by thier hatred of the United States. While I was never an active duty member of the armed forces, I worked for a company that supported them in varoius manners on deployments in the world. I personally worked 2 LOGCAP missions, one in Haiti and one in Bosnia, I was team leader for a AFCAP partnership in the Balkins as well as contract leader for CONCAP in the U.S. The amount of manpower, resources, and pure monetary aid the United States dedicates on an annual basis is extrodinary not only through the Navy and others, but through USAID, the UN, NATO, MSC and the aforementioned "cap" contracts, USTDA and the myriad of other programs that are funded by our great country that no other one comes close to. Hats off to you for your time defending our liberties.

Belial- Having been the Chief Steward on numerous sea-trails for T-AO's, T-AGS's, LHD's and LSD's I can assure you that the term you are using is not correct when you are identifing this vessel. An amphibious assault vessel assults the target by sea to land via smaller crafts, hence the name. The complement of on-board Marines utilize the aforementioned Helicopters for rapid deployment not water craft. The LSD is the correct amphibious assault ship.

"I can tell you from personal experience that one of the most benevolent organizations in the U.S. Government is the Department of Defence..."

oooo

Although I can't claim personal experience, I don't believe that the history of the DOD in the DR has been benevolent in the least.

The DOD (and its predecessor the WD) have invaded, bombarded, blockaded, occupied, genocided, and, from time to time, kicked butts and shot up the town.

Texasshoe -- great background that enables you to add sound reasoning to the discussion. That whole "imperialist" business is so early 20th century. Folks better get with it and start understanding the idea of globalization, internationalism, worldwide terrorism, etc. Quoting someone as insigificant as Lieutenant Colonel Chavez doesn't necessarily earn anyone intellect points. The guy is certainly not Marx, Lennin, or even Castro for that matter. By the way, I oversee LOGCAP contracting option out of my shop -- still in government in civilian capacity.

Belial. We've got to let go of this whole affinity with the 16 and 65 interventions. Do you truly believe that if the intent at the time had been a real invasion -- that the DR would be the wonderfully complex, but free beauty that it is today? In the words of Junot Diaz: n_gro please...... The reality is that those interventions saved us and are partly responsible for the great freedom we have today. You've got to admit that with all the problems we have in the DR today -- apagones, corruption, cronyism, etc., it is still a wonderful treasure. I alternate my days every month between Miami and Santiago and have the same quality of life at each location. Do you know how much that's worth -- rhetorical -- priceless. Ask my friends from Venezuela, Cuba, Nicaragua, and Bolivia if they have that freedom. I think you know the answer.

"An amphibious assault vessel assults the target by sea to land via smaller crafts, hence the name," Tex wiggles around in his private definition.

oooo

So, you say, if the killers float ashore, they're amphibious. But If they fly ashore in choppers, they're not amphibious,

That's not the definition of "amphibious" that Merriam-Webster gives.

"Amphibious refers to a military capacity or operation 'executed by coordinated action of land, sea, and air forces organized for invasion.' "

http://reference.aol.com/dictiona....=Amphibious&lookupbtn=Look+Up

The US Navy describes, specifies, defines "Amphibious Assault Ships - LHA/LHD/LHA(R)."

Here:

http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact....asp?cid=4200&tid=400&ct=4

If you scroll down near the bottom of the page, you see the USS Kearsarge listed among the boats the Navy considers are its "Amphibious Assault Ships - LHA/LHD/LHA(R)"

Tex, your definition is neither Merriam-Webster's nor US Navy's.

The motto of the reactionary all over the world is "If you fight for imperialism, then imperialism will supply you with a nice retirement when you get too old to fight. Therefore, imperialism is benevolent and perhaps beautiful."

It's as simple as that.

We will not discuss the genocide and carnage, because such thing show bad taste.

Plus, imperialists are animals and animals are supposed to be savage and barbaric.

But anyway, a nice, soft retirement is just compensation for a life of savagery and barbarity that imperialism imposes.

CARACAS, Venezuela - Give up your gas-guzzler and get a free car. That's President Hugo Chavez's offer to Venezuelans.

http://fe6.news.sp1.yahoo.com/s/a...._ylt=Arg6inRybAcRDgNpC.lt1B.3IxIF

Chavez says he plans to start a program next year that will give away cars running on less-polluting natural gas to people who turn in old cars that consume "too much gasoline."

The socialist leader says he'll even throw in a year of free fuel — though that's a relatively minor bonus in oil-rich Venezuela, where gasoline goes for 12 cents a gallon.

Saturday's offer didn't say what sort of cars will be offered or how many will be given out.

Belial. Great display of tolerance and maturity. I think you're the same guy that used to sign on by some crazy goulosh............... or other and always wrote stupidities in German. Your comments are offensive, insulting and out of line. You have no idea of the level of humility, humaness, and care for the oppressed by which I live my life. Perhaps that's why I chose to serve a greater cause then myself. I did not own a regular pair of shoes till I was 10 years old, and my transportation was a burro, was not priviledge to running water, and certainly not electricity so to lable me imperialist is utterly rediculous. Because of my very difficult and humble beginnings, I've made it my lifelong goal to contribute to the greater good of society. I guess that by being offensive and condesending is how you intend to make a difference.

Montesino,

The definitons that he has thrown out there are correct as speaking from the dictionary. The sea trials that I did for each class of ship mentioned earlier was both sets, Builders and Owners I believe that my total runs to about 16 in all I am a Plankowner in 4 of the vessels that were built and turned directly to MSC. The difference that he can not see is that for folks like myself, having walked the walk, there is no need to talk the talk. When you argure with a 4 year old, you normally end up losing. He does not need me to confirm his mental capacity.

Belial says-
"Chavez says he plans to start a program next year that will give away cars running on less-polluting natural gas to people who turn in old cars that consume "too much gasoline."

That is all well and good, most of the cars on the road there would never pass inspection here, however having lived a number of years there and just recently returned from a trip there I can tell you that unless you live in the capitol, good luck finding a station that carries GNV. Once again a program brought to you by Chavez that sounds fantastic but the reality is, wont work no infrastructure in place to support the cars for refueling. Just like when he built the milk processing plant in his home state of Barinias, only problem no cattle farms within 250 miles, no cows no milk. "Venezuela progresando para Usted, Socialismo, Patria o muerte.

So this US navy ship in the Southern coast of DR, does not have anything to do, with a Russian navy ship, scheduled in November for Russian Naval Exercises in the Caribbean with Venezuela?

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=10177


Caribbean sea Map
http://www.nationsonline.org/maps/central_america_map_855.jpg

This humanitarian event has been scheduled for over a year now. It was published in the press last year in fact. So while coincidental -- yes -- but a direct response to Russian ships in the area, no. Russian ships in the area has never been anything new anyhow -- that it's being picked up in the mainstream media because LTC Chavez wants it as such is one thing -- but generally speakng nothing new. I've witnessed them picking up the trash we dumpped off an aircraft carrier on many instances -- and many of these instances were in the Caribbean Sea.

The best way to deal with Belial (the devil) is just skip his Communist rhetoric propoganda and euphemism's.

I am just amazed how he is still a free man becuae his hate for the US should raise all sorts of buzzers and bell's freedom of speech is not what it used to be.

Continued

Patent 6,947,978, granted this week, describes a process based on latency, or time lag between computers exchanging data, of "numerous" known locations on the Internet to build a "network latency topology map" for all users. Identifying the physical location of an individual user, reports CNET News.com, could then be accomplished by measuring how long it takes to connect to an unknown computer from numerous known machines, and using the latency response to display location on a map.

LIFE WITH BIG BROTHER
National Security Agency
gets fix on Internet users
Top secret group applies for patent

to ID physical address of Web surfers

© 2008 WorldNetDaily.com



Internet users hoping to protect their privacy by using anti-virus software, Web anonymizers, false identities and disabled cookies on their computer's Web browser have something new to worry about – a patent filed by the National Security Agency (NSA) for technology that will identify the physical location of any Web surfer.

Personally, I clear out all the "cookies" on my machine three to four times daily. That keeps the snoops out for themost part. It is, however, a bit inconvenient when leaving my mailroom and returning at a later time since I must "log in" all over again.
It's worth it tho since I don't get near as many "Scam" messages as I did before starting the procedure over 3 months ago.

TexasBill

"Belial. Great display of tolerance and maturity," montesino compliments me lavishly, although he may be a little less than forthcoming.




Montesino, please, think nothin' of it.

Goethe relates in Faust the thoughts of Mephisto after a chat with the Authority.

oooo

I like to see the Governor now and then,
And take good care to keep relations civil.
It's decent in the first of gentlemen
To speak so friendly, even to the devil.

oooo

If Goethe writes it, how can any of us ... mere mortals, burden with bodies, unable to do miracles, and ignorant of good and evil ... differ with the great Goethe.

There's always a risk in having foreign warships in town.
What did happen to Commander Lionel "Buster" Crabb in Portsmouth in 1956?
http://hillblogger3.blogspot.com/....er-crabb-uks-real-life-james.html
In case there any mischief the Dominican Navy could buy some drones and mini-subs.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/middle_east/6356971.stm

(1) "The best way to deal with Belial (the devil) is just skip his Communist rhetoric propoganda and euphemism's."

(2) "I am just amazed how he is still a free man becuae his hate for the US should raise all sorts of buzzers and bell's freedom of speech is not what it used to be."

(3) "Continued"

above by Jander, save the numbers

oooo

(1) As for "Belial (the devil)," Jander, you are far too mature ideologically and ethically to believe in those ancient Zionist tales in a "holy book" that the Nazarenes later stole from the Jews to produce the "new book."

If you believe in rubbish from both "holy book" and "new book," then Jander, by all means:

It's yo thang. Do what you want to do. Nobody can tell ya. Who to sock it to."

(2) To defend to US Constitution from Bush who says it's nothing but a Goddamn piece of paper isn't hate for the USA. http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/article_7779.shtml

It's the opposite of hate.

Where's (3)?

Hey guys, do not listen to Belial as he is incarcerated in the big slammer in Texas and does nothing all day except trying to stir up controversy and do this "retro-speak".
I mean I haven't heard so many times lately the words "imperialist" ""socialist" and other words that Belial copied from a booklet he probably got from the prison library.
Belial is just craving for attention and by adoring the likes of "por que no te callas?" Chavez in a english internet publication, being critical about democracy and displaying his fondness for authoritarian rule (because of his fondness for prison guards) just stirs up controversy and attention.
Him and a few of his "fellow commnie travelers" in the slammer just lonely for manly company.

Generoso is a stand-up kind of guy.

Yeah, he hates me. He'll cut my guts out.

But it's nothing personal. A guy like that, you can do business with. See?

When generoso puts me in the joint, it's nothin' personal. It's another one of his failed attempts at humor.

Generoso says I "retro-speak." He thereby admits I don't used bourgeois double-talk that beat Dominicans out of estimated $2.5 billions with the securities fraud that causes the current financial crisis all over the world.

Generoso, listen to me!

I don't use bourgeois double-talk because I'm not trying beat anybody. But I know how use bourgeois double-talk if I want to. But I don't want to.

That's what you want to do is to beat somebody, but you're not smart enough.

Nothin' personal.

Belial, I was right. You are that same guy that recently got ganned from this page although under a different identity. Why you feel the need to quote from Johann Wolfgan von Goethe's tragic play: Faust -- is beyond me. But it is certainly a dead giveaway of that same guy that hides behind the computer that his parents purchased for him. After all, it's already been established that you most likely don't work, are very likely a social misfit, and only because you have good parents that keep in a padded room are you able to espouse such idiotic ideas.

Belial:
Find a dictionary in the prison library and look up the definition of your favorite word "bourgeois" and learn to apply it. Just in case library is off limits for now here it is:

bourgeois


bour·geois [ boor ?w?, b?r ?w? ]


adjective
Definition:

1. conventional: associated with affluent middle-class people, who are often characterized as conventional, conservative, or materialistic in outlook

2. capitalist: according to Marxist theory, relating to the social class that owns the means of producing wealth and is regarded as exploiting the working class

[Mid-16th century. < French, "citizen of a city or borough" < Latin burgus "castle, borough" < Germanic]

bour·geois noun

and regarding our comment "Yeah, he hates me. He'll cut my guts out."
I will never do no such thing, never in a million years. That's prison talk, civilized people converse
and exchange intelligent ideas. Never do threats or resort to violence. The pen is mightier than he sword.

gouletcolonial: you always had "Belial's" number. Poor guy, he is very angry like a puppy that has been abused and beaten by his owner for ages.
Sad thing is he really is not dumb, just that he does not apply himself to better things that will enrich instead of bring misery to humanity.
I guess this media is his voice that is crying out for attention.

p. 1 or 2

bour·geois [ boor ?w?, b?r ?w? ]

adjective
Definition:

1. conventional: associated with affluent middle-class people, who are often characterized as conventional, conservative, or materialistic in outlook

2. capitalist: according to Marxist theory, relating to the social class that owns the means of producing wealth and is regarded as exploiting the working class

oooo

Hmm. Very good. Yes. Good. I like.

So, bourgeois is either (1) upper middle class or (2) capitalist who owns means of production [or means of distribution or both].

(1) is only a mere wish to become a capitalist who owns means of production; but (2) is the real existence of the capitalist who owns means of production.

One must acknowledge a difference between wish and reality to grasp the distinction between the two types, (1) and (2), although they are both identical in their "wishes" or their subjective make-up.

CON'T

p. 2 of 2

So, (1) is a phony who may or may not, one day, become the real thing.

But (2) is real, not just a wish, who preys on humanity and robs humanity of the means of life.

Yes, both are bourgeois, but in different senses -- in the different senses of only a wish and a reality that is more than a wish.

"Belial, I was right. You are that same guy that recently got ganned from this page although under a different identity," montesino guesses wrong about me.

0000

Montesino, I never pretend to be someone other than myself although myself may be unwelcome occasionally by some others.

As Goethe writes in Faust "You match the spirit that you comprehend, not me."

Written by: gouletcolonial, 5 Oct 2008 9:50 AM
From: Canada
josean and chill let this be a warning to you....one mistake from you or your kind and it will be an @ss kicking for you guys


you take pride in being the first one to comment about this subject I know you do, but your words are hallow and worthless.

"josean and chill let this be a warning to you....one mistake from you or your kind and it will be an @ss kicking for you guys ..."

oooo

GC stupidly and inadvertently admits the US imperialist wolves arrive, disguised in their "medical assistance" clothes, but the wolves will torture or murder ... or do both to ... Josean and Chill if the wolves are lucky enough to get a pretext.

GC's slang for US imperialist torture and murder is "@ss kicking."

So colorful.

My fellow Dominicans, sons and daughters of Duarte,
Sanchez Y Mella. If you can recall or ask your parents, grandparents about the last time the United States had a presence in the Dominican Republic. Ask them how many of your brothers and sisters died. How many where slaughtered?
Have you ever heard of GUN BOAT diplomacy, in which the United States uses its massive Naval Gun boats to intimidate countries and their governments. Ladies and gents, LF wants another 4 years. He is a huge fan of Balaguer, and we know he was a U.S. puppet. Chavez has Russians visiting him daily now, the Americans would like to restart the cold war. Remember people that hold money in weapons stocks make money during a war.
Don’t listen to lies of gouletcolonial he does not know our history because he is not one of us, Dios, Patria, Libertad

I never cared much about the innocent people dying in Iraq, until I learned about the war of 1965. I knew that the United States had installed Trujillo I know that they had trained him but I did not know all the other evil things that they had done to us. They don’t really care about the Iraqis, and they have never and will never really care about us.
Just like the drop bombs on those innocent woman and children of Iraq...
They sent mortars raining down upon the very same people you call Dominicans.
Did you know that soo may people died in the war of 1965 that they had to through the bodies into the “ El malecon” yes the in wich you can see them again. Lords knows what will happen this time.
Dios, Patria, Libertad

Yes, the DR with ALBA needs a navy with submarines. In WW2 the submarines of the USA, although only 2 percent of the US Navy accounted for sinking 60% of the Jap merchant marine and 30% of the Jap navy. This would make the Caribb more difficult to invade. A visit like this is a 'wake-up' call for action to build good defence against aggresssion. France, Brazil may help.
http://www.brazilnews.net/story/410130
Russia also:
http://www.boston.com/news/world/....zuela_may_buy_russian_submarines/
Submarines are also be used for tourism and the drug trade.
http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSN0325244420080103
Before GC you dismiss -
http://www.nationaldefensemagazin..../Pages/Diesel_Submarines3451.aspx
Other navies are acting : e.g. Sri Lanka.
http://www.srilankawatch.com/inde....om_content&do_pdf=1&id=14
Other technologies are important - updated k-men; radio controlled drones,

radio controlled small fibreglass boats packed with explosives, 'lazy' torpedos etc. Decoy clusters of radio controlled boats, permanent installation of magnetic anomaly passive sonar arrays on sea bed, MROVs etc. New military MROV's under development use new battery technlogy, have high range and depth, speed and can lie undetected for long periods of time.
S.

I am surprised Belial didnt use his old tune "bourgeois" on this posts. I continue to say as a Dominicano "ausente" DT offers a neutral piece of news which I personally appreciate but these low lifes Chavez fans keep spewing this soiled propaganda and always trying to skew the news. Still they can enjoy the freedom of speech those dirty Americans have brought upon them. Goulet, Montesino stop being polite, "belial" is an idiot period. Is it an airplane, is it a bird? is it a baby in soiled diapers crying for attention? Or maybe he is a US operative disguised to dig out anti-US sympathizers, it's "belial"
This is the kind of filth filling many colleges around the US and latin america, now there are some smart individuals who see it for what it is of course many others will drink the cool-aid.

josean and chill stop chugging the Kool Aid.....stop the insanity

another clear thinking Texan comes on the scene to compensate for paid commie stooge apparachik Belial.....precisionM please feel free to wack the traitor with your pinata stick with impunity he will squeel like the schweinhund he is

Yes, Belgrano's crew paid the price for the US support of the Junta that killed so many people.
http://www.opendemocracy.net/democracy-protest/catholicchurch_2709.jsp
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB185/index.htm
GC, skitzoid man, I guess, thinks that George Washington University is not the KKK and should be regarded with the greatest suspicion. Uphold freedom and democracy!
I forget Margaret Thatcher a communist too.
S.

Thsi is the start of the US naval build up in response to russian ships invading the islands and venez.

Every 2 years the US Navy hold manuevers in conjunction with the DR. Nothing new here. Happens all the time.

Good Info Drop abc200 & chillaxin201.

"Written by: abc200, 6 Oct 2008 7:00 AM
From: United Kingdom
Yes, the DR with ALBA needs a navy with submarines."

That is soooo funny it is pathetic.

The cost of one "used" Submarine is more that the entire Domincan Military Budget.
The cost of maintaining one Sub is more than the entire Dominican Budget.
The DR doesn't have the infrastructure to maintain a sub.
Strategically the DR has no military need for a Submarine.
A submarine is all but useless in Drug interdiction.

The thought of using a "Tourist" sub to then convert it when needed is beyond ridiculous.

"I am surprised Belial didnt use his old tune "bourgeois" on this posts. I continue to say as a Dominicano "ausente" DT offers a neutral piece of news which I personally appreciate but these low lifes Chavez fans keep spewing this soiled propaganda and always trying to skew the news. Still they can enjoy the freedom of speech those dirty Americans have brought upon them. Goulet, Montesino stop being polite, "belial" is an idiot period. Is it an airplane, is it a bird? is it a baby in soiled diapers crying for attention? Or maybe he is a US operative disguised to dig out anti-US sympathizers, it's "belial" This is the kind of filth filling many colleges around the US and latin america, now there are some smart individuals who see it for what it is of course many others will drink the cool-aid."

0000

Montesino, you spoke of my want of civility. See the effrontery and insolence aimed me?

Well, a few are crude, uncouth, and rude.

I shall remain dignified toward this trash.

" Goulet, Montesino stop being polite, "belial" is an idiot period, " PrecisionM instructs his pupils.

oooo

PrecisionM must be a bizarre person if he believes GC is "polite" to the "idiot."

PrecisionM clearly shares GC's idiocy, believing, as they do, that impolite utterance is sound argument or sound argument must be impolite.

GC is impolite because he is incapable of sound argument.

PrecisionM is impolite because he apparently believes impolite is a far superior form of sound argument.

In any case, the ideal toward which I strive as an internationalist and a patriot is a combination of polite and sound argument ... no matter what clowns and buffoons say.

Even drug runners have subs these days.
Singapore, another island nation is acquiring.
http://www.forbes.com/business/feeds/afx/2005/09/29/afx2250795.html
http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/breakingnews.php?id=60016
DR defense budget only 1 percent of GDP about 153M dollars.
Canada got a bad deal buying subs at 188BM dollars .
France has some for sale:
http://www.janes.com/extracts/extract/jnc/jnc_2884.html
Spread over 8 years it would not increase the defense budget much. Cuba, Venez, brazil, Russia could help. They all have ambitions in the area.
DR could become the Singapore of the Caribb! once it has good defence.
Actually from a country that could not get suitably armoured personnel and vehicles to Iraq your argument regarding conversions is a little hollow. I have worked on some seemingly crazy military conversions that have yeilded success. In simulations light submarines in underwater caves, shelters etc. are suprisingly effiective using either

or indirect methods e.g. frogmen. Special mines etc. launched from below are very efficective against capital ships as the TO may be less than one minute.
S.

Gov. Palin accuses Sen. Obama of being a "pal" or supporter of terrorists and terrorist activity.

US citizens who denounce the genocide perpetrated on over a 1,000,000 Iraqi citizens who were completely innocent of Bush's, Cheney's and McCainn's propaganda manipulation and dirty lies about WMDs and Iraq's 9/11 role are labelled "pals" or supporters of terrorists and terrorist activity.

About two-thirds of the US people oppose the US imperialist aggression against the Iraqi people.

So, Palin must believe that two-thirds of the US people are "pals" or supporters of terrorists and terrorist activity.

Slimy GOPs.

Why, a majority of the people in Mobile, Ala. oppose the US imperialist aggression against the Iraqi people.

Mobile may soon get a visit from the USS Kearsarge "Hello, Mobile, we spent 6 months in Iraq last year and had a great time. Boy, did we cut loose."

Belial don't you need to go wash your Turban and sharpen your sabre..

And get that vest fitted ?

abc200,

Exactly what does the DR need a submarine for? Are you familiar with the strategic and Tactical uses of a Submarine?

Who or what is this submarine going to defend against?

BTW Belial

About those 72 virgens they are all spoken for.

Mass arms shipment confiscated in route to ABC and his fellow merry men.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pS6ROYvR3c&NR=1

Shipment was caught on a rubber band powered submarine that was forced to make port on fantasy Island

News update on Belial, typical though says one thing then another.

http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/....__article.html/told_officers.html

My kind of conservation effort who is with me ?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_new....highlands_and_islands/7654407.stm

Next port of call for USS Kearsarge ... northern Virginia which surprisingly went Communist.

Comrades of northern Virginia, welcome to the Party and the revolution.

oooo

McCain's brother says N. Va. 'Communist country'
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-....e/2008/10/05/AR2008100500794.html

Joe McCain, speaking at an event in support of his brother, called two Democratic-leaning areas in Northern Virginia "communist country," according to a report on The Washington Post's Web site.

"I've lived here for at least 10 years and before that about every third duty I was in either Arlington or Alexandria, up in communist country," Joe McCain, a Navy veteran, said at an event in Loudoun County, Va.

Joe McCain then apologized, but the remark drew laughter at the event, according to the report.

Virginia has long been a Republican stronghold in presidential elections, but Democrat Barack Obama is running even or ahead of McCain in recent state polls.

Exactly what does the DR need a submarine for? Are you familiar with the strategic and Tactical uses of a Submarine?

Who or what is this submarine going to defend against?

There are many 1000's of papers on this subject. Some give about 80 scenarios for submarine use. In some simulations of crisis management there are 2 or 3 thousand different combinations. Singgapore and numerous other countries counter ever-present threats with sumbmarines. There are also families of sub-strategic uses.
Five strategic uses were given in 1648 - since that time the uses have expanded greatly.

History shows that threats emerge very quickly and full preparation is essential.

S.

abc200

SO in other words you can find no valid reason for the DR to acquire a sub!

ABC,

The question presented to you was "Exactly what does the DR need a submarine for, and do YOU know the strategic and Tactical uses of a Submarine?" Not singapore, not Brazil, and the first thing I would like to know is who is going to man it. As far from what most of the posters here would consider as a valid viewpoint, you should at least try to answer the questions as posed instead of giving such vague answers as to make one think you are just trying to piss poeple off.

Lets start with, crumbilng infrastructure, everyone stealing electricity, constant blackouts, bus wrecks full of tourists, corruption run wild and you think a submarine will solve the problems on the island.

Cant even keep his own Cabinet together on the same page, "Hey I know lets buy a submarine"

http://www.dominicantoday.com/dr/....-mum-as-officials-keep-quarreling

Written by: gouletcolonial, 6 Oct 2008 7:31 AM
From: Canada
another clear thinking Texan comes on the scene to compensate for paid commie stooge apparachik Belial.....precisionM please feel free to wack the traitor with your pinata stick with impunity he will squeel like the schweinhund he is

I am looking forward to the day that I can kick you out of DR like they Kicked you out of Cuba

Submarines are baseline defence:
Make invasion very difficult.
Protect the seabed during exploration.
Allow for landings of small numbers in great secrecy.
Discourage any aggressive action.
Protect shipping.
Protect against underwater intrusion/threats.
Assist in fishing protection.
etc. etc.
Blackouts are due to importing/selling too many high power appliances without planning and happen in many countries such as India. India is building submarines:
http://www.india-defence.com/reports-3240
Much infrastructure is very good here. e.g. Metro, coach services, internet, broardcasting, mobile phones, many but not all roads, airports etc. Tour buses have crashed in other countries.
Brazil:
http://www.gmanews.tv/story/11711....l-to-spend-160M-on-nuke-submarine
Submarine defence has the potential to make DR more attractive for investment in infrastructure.

S.

Submarines are baseline defence
No they are not. They are a "luxury" defense once a nation has established a baseline defense. Air-Land-Sea

Make invasion very difficult.
A squadron of light attack planes would do a much better job

Protect the seabed during exploration.
What seabeds does the DR need to explore?

Allow for landings of small numbers in great secrecy.
So now the DR are into covert-ops on foreign soil?

Discourage any aggressive action.
From who? Haiti?

Protect shipping.
Again. From who?
Would a few fast attack craft do the same job and be much cheaper?

Protect against underwater intrusion/threats.
WHO?

Assist in fishing protection.
A Subarine for a job that can be done by some game wardens with a few Boston Whalers?

There is no strategic need for the DR to have a submarine.

"instead of giving such vague answers as to make one think you are just trying to piss poeple off."....Tex you have guessed right about the wanker from hell....he is just trying to piss us off

"Protect the seabed during exploration," abc200 asserts.

"What seabeds does the DR need to explore?" the notorious anthonyC inquires.

OOOO

Under Pertocaribe, Venezuelan and Cuban engineers and geologists, among others independently of the foul bourgeois type, are exploring the DR seabed.

So far, the results, of the Venezuelan and Cuban explorations, have been promising, but not conclusive.

This info is extremely valuable to imperialists and their comprador slime.

A DR torpedo will often run off an nosy imperialist spy sub.

PS -- A comprador is "a native of a colonised country who acts as the agent of the coloniser."
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/comprador

The mass of the Dominican bourgeoisie is comprador.

But the Dominican bourgeoisie has a patriotic sector, too.

Sea defence based on surface craft has proved very vunerable. Light aircraft cannot operate in all conditions. Simple surface to air missiles and air to air missiles can down light aircraft easily.
Exploration of seabed for gas has been proposed a number of times. One cannot assume that Haiti and Puerto Rico among other states will always be friendly. Shipping is vital for the DR.

There were plenty of people who did not see the German threat in 1933. But the Spanish Civil War in 1936. US, Russia, Brazil, China etc. with political changes could pose a threat.
Malaysia's view:
http://www.singapore-window.org/sw02/020605a2.htm
Singapore is only three million people.
Australia:
Defence wants its new submarines to form the most lethal conventional fleet in the world, with the new boats being larger, faster and quieter than the Collins and with a greater array of firepower.

Defence wants its new submarines to form the most lethal conventional fleet in the world, with the new boats being larger, faster and quieter than the Collins and with a greater array of firepower.

It is expected that the new boats will be capable of carrying long-range cruise missiles as well as short-range tactical land-strike missiles.


The boats will also utilise the new generation of air-independent propulsion systems that allow the submarines to stay underwater longer, greatly increasing their operational effectiveness.

From China:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subm....e_People%27s_Liberation_Army_Navy
http://bigguyralph.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!95E420DBB6AE57BC!5419.entry

The US navy seems to think subs are still a threat. Therefore good defence for an island nation?
"
Nations there in recent years have begun to acquire stealthy diesel-electric submarines. Some of those nations, say Navy officials, could one day threaten U.S. access to strategic coast

areas of the world or interrupt the flow of commerce around the globe. Although the Navy has the world’s most technologically advanced fleet – including state-of-the-art nuclear attack submarines – officials acknowledge that these comparatively low-tech diesel-electric boats could give an enemy an asymmetric advantage.
Asymmetric advantage sounds good for a small island nation!
S.

abc the wanker spewing useless data like a" belial of the absurd " or double absurd continues to sucker in people who are unaware of his evil intentions

You have still not shown one piece of evidence where the DR is in need of a Submarine.

You are dreaming.

BTW Stop bringing up Singapore. Singapore is an economic Powerhouse that is on one of the most important shipping lanes on the planet.
The DR is not.

another sucker takes the bait

Floating hospital's medical mission
USS Kearsage is docked off Santo Domingo Port and doctors on board plan to see approximately 6,000 low-income patients. The medical team on board includes ophthalmology, dental, pediatric, and gynecology and obstetrics staff who will work from 8 to 5pm. The medical teams are working simultaneously in Santo Domingo, Bayaguana (Monte Plata) and from the naval base at Las Calderas, Bani.
US Ambassador Robert Fannin, his wife Dr Lisa Fannin and Dominican Navy chief Vice Admiral Julio Cesar Bayonet were present at the launch of the program. Patients are being transferred to the ship by helicopter. Project Hope is also taking part in the initiative.
Another medical group, under the Foundation Arizona, arrived on Saturday for a series of operations for 60 low-income patients at the HOMS Hospital in Santiago, announced hospital director Dr. Rafael Sanchez Espanol.

belial the paid commie stooge says they are murderers and spies and chill his Igor agrees ...But they are highly qualified medical people ....not Havana cab drivers

Together with other Caribb nations DR is becoming a powerhouse with good growth. The Mid and South Atlantic is imoportant for S. American and Caribb shipping to Europe. I never proposed a large fleet - just one or two. Dominicans would be proud of their submarines, the training etc. would help the rest of the fleet and the cost is moderate over a 30 year period. Air supremacy is far more difficult to achieve. The boat or boats could be an important element in ALBA defence spreading influence and winning friends. There is a large untapped tourist potential in S. America and such defence would raise the profile of the DR. France or Russia could e a valued partner in the Atlantic. - such partnership brings trade.
S.

anthonyC
During the Falklands/Malvinas war a single Argentine Type 209 managed to elude l5 British frigates and the antisubmarine carriers. The San Luis maneuvered into torpedo range of the British fleet and launched three torpedoes, although all three shots were unsuccessful. Early in the conflict a British submarine sank the Argentine cruiser Genera Belgrano with two straight-running torpedoes of design dated to World War II.

The subs will get more sophisticated with AIC, Stirling engines etc. and cheaper as India, Korea etc. step up production.
Navy days and tours etc. of navel bases are important in raising awareness of the importance of this defence.
S.

You ignore defence logic - submarines are important assets.
S.

"You ignore defence logic - submarines are important assets."

You ignore basic logic.
Why does the DR need a Submarine?
Set aside cost. Something the DR could not afford now or in the near future.

What does the DR need the Submarine to defend against?

The US? Please.

Cuba? If Cuba for some stupid reason was to attack the DR the US would crush Cuba in a day?

Venezuela? See the US reaction to a Cuban attack.

Haiti?

Drug smugglers? Submarines are not that good for aircraft interdiction.

I would venture to say that one Submarine for the DR would more than likely superceede all previous naval expendatures.

http://www.hazegray.org/worldnav/

I agree with you anothonyC , just on this one...
but you know hwo it is they will sell one to DR and LF will buy it to make his friends in the sates happy. even thou subs run in the Billions... you know some of LF's friends in the states stock in defense contracts.

The US won't sell a sub to the DR or any other country for that matter.

The US only builds Nuclear Subs and we don't sell them to anybody except the Brits.

A threat can emerge at any time. Why does the US have 10 very large aircraft carriers?
The Falklands were invaded for no good reason - the historical claim of Argentina was very weak and the people did not want Argentine rule. There is instability in the Caribb and S. America. I do think the sub would be USA built - possibly Russia, Korea, China, France or India could supply. Navel facilties could be useful to other countries and bring in valuable foreign exchange. This part of the Atlantic has great strategic value. Credit terms can be very good. It is better to import a sub than numerous petrol guzlers, giant fridges, large screen TV's etc. It could last for 30 years and have numerous benefits. Of course the defense of the area should be co-ordinated through ALBA.
S.

http://www.cubaheadlines.com/2008....se_council_including_to_cuba.html
http://www.netnewspublisher.com/v....tin-america-venezuelan-viewpoint/
S.

abc200

The only nation in the Area that potentially poses a threat to the DR is Venezuela.

The Falklands was an issue that had been simmering for over 100 years.

The DR does not have any territorial desputes.
The DR does not have any offshore natural resources that needs protecting.
The DR is not startegically located on any shipping lanes.
The DR does not even come close to having enough money to purchase and maintain a submarine.
The DR has no strategic or tactical need for a Submarine.

Total imports about 12 billon dollars - how much of this is essential and could not be replaced by local production? - a great deal I suspect. A 50 million dollar a year payment on a sub or two would not involve a large sacrifice - and would considerably enhance DR status. GDP per capita about 9000 dollars.
The US, Mexico and numerous other coutries could become a threat in 3-5 year timescale. Soon the seabed will be exploited - ditto Cuba. Poland when invaded by Germany did have any disputes. Better equiped Switzerland did not get invaded. Shipping is important for any island nation. Your argument could be applied to the US, Brazil, France, Malaysia etc. all countries that choose to have defense forces including Subs.
S.

"The US, Mexico and numerous other coutries could become a threat in 3-5 year timescale"

Ok now you are just being stupid.

The US become a threat.
If the US did do you think a couple of diesel Subs would make a difference?

No: politics changes quickly. Also non-nation groups have attempted takeovers of island nations - external coup. There is instability.
The outcome of instability such as in Bolivia today can be the contiuation of moderate democracy, extremist democracy ( as in Serbia before interverntion ) or some sort of dictatorship.
http://dandelionsalad.wordpress.c....-coup-in-bolivia-by-jorge-martin/
Island nations are susceptable to external coup. History of Fiji etc.
http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2006/11/30/fiji-coup.html
http://www.fijilive.com/archive/s....df=2007/07/2006coup_aftermath.pdf
Countries, busnessmen etc can finance external coup attempts.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Equatorial_Guinea_coup_d'%C3%A9tat_attempt
Warships appear at such times.
There is a deterrent effect that few nations want to risk capital ships - their public consider it a black mark at least.
S.

Isee the wanker is still wanking your chain tonyc

Yes, the US has one constitution and set of rights on US soil and another for all the plebs living in other countries. Can you trust them? Can you trust GC a US sympathiser with his Lord Haw-Haw speeches - very sorry diatribe?
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200810....on_go_ca_st_pe/detainee_treatment
S.

Just like the IRS says " Trust me I am here to help you "

Hey people don't worry about the DR. We are just updating our GPS systems, and spy fotos.....so we are set to go after the Drug lords & Mr. Venezuela.....you know how Republicans do it, we must go out with a BIG BANG!!!!...before Bush's term is up.